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Use this IdeaSpace to post ideas about Domino Designer.

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: Domino Designer
: Templates
: Rishi Sahi1677 11 Feb 2009
: / Email
It would be really great if IBM provides some commonly used templates like timesheet,help desk, bug system etc.. in the Domino like Microsoft provides for SharePoint .

1) Bruce Elgort8023 (11 Feb 2009)
Rishi are you familiar with OpenNTF.org { Link } ?
2) Rishi Sahi1677 (11 Feb 2009)
Hi Bruce, Yes i do .. But I wish the if branding and concept could come from IBM would be really great. Being a hard core LN professional, It's really pain when your company consider SharePoint only because they offer loads of free templates which you can implement as your need. Most of the companies are thinking to cut development cost and go for branded templates. I assume OpenNTF not attracts the decision making people in the company.
3) Patrick Kwinten22008 (11 Feb 2009)
Today I received a request for uploading and sharing images. Looking at some projects on OpenNTF and around on the web a combination of those examples would make a great Social Web template...
4) Patrick Kwinten22008 (11 Feb 2009)
@Bruce: aren't most projects on OpenNTF more like 'half baked' applications? Most of them require work and in the current situation there is very little budget for development projects. I can see MOSS could take leaps here but implementation/migration projects are also not for free...
5) Ben Poole1705 (11 Feb 2009)
I hear people talking about OpenNTF apps as being "half-baked" a lot, and it ticks me off frankly: if you want apps brought up to scratch, GET INVOLVED!

I don't just mean code either: OpenNTF needs people willing to test, people willing to write documentation, and so on and so forth.
6) Rishi Sahi1677 (11 Feb 2009)
@Patrick , You don't need to pay for WSS , yeah if you need MOSS then must pay. For WSS you have even plenty of apps template which can be used with zero development efforts.But I have experience it's not up to the mark like Domino, it's quite costly to think out of box solution in SharePoint.
7) Mark Demicoli11442 (12 Feb 2009)
@Ben Poole: Agree completely. I've started serveral OpenNTF projects and had heaps of people using but very very few if any wanting to make serious contributions. I think the reason maybe goes with the territory. Most LN people are pros involved in full time or contract work full time whereas with other platforms you have a much broader base of students with time on their hands. Anyone ever heard of Notes being taught at UNI?
8) David Killingsworth3990 (17 Feb 2009)
Many of the things I have pulled down from OpenNTF seem pretty good to me.

We are a heavy user of OpenNTF 1.7b Mail Experience, which I recommended to the company I'm working for. that's 2800 users. There wasn't any documentation, so I spent two weeks writing a manual on how to use it. I contributed it to the OpenNTF Mail Experience project when I was finished.

I've worked with Vince Shuurman periodically on it, and I can tell you that it's not "half baked"

Additionally, we needed a Brazilian Portuguese translation of it. I asked Vince the best approach to go about it. We hired a local Brazilian Notes consulting shop (who had never heard of OpenNTF miraculously) to take the default Brazilian 7.03 Mail template, and customize it with the OpenNTF 7.02 template changes. We paid for the customization, and Vince was kind enough to consult his time on the best approach to getting it done (versus just translating the English version) and I submitted it to Vince as a contribution on OpenNTF.

I got involved.

I do agree with the idea though. It would be much better if we could have some awesome applications right out of the box, and the Help Desk application on OpenNTF would be an easy win. As would be advanced document library or server inventory databases.

I thought one of the annoucements at Lotusphere was that IBM was going to have developers improve some of the applications at OpenNTF. Is this idea asking IBM to go one step further and include those template as part of the Domino install?

One thing that I would like to see is a simple application for Domino Admins like me who are not advanced developers to setup a simple FAQ team website with Ajax views. This would allow us admins to show how easily it is to setup a web application.

I setup a Domino based website for our team with FAQ, downloads, info number for our hotline and the service desk etc. This was to showcase what Domino could do and be sort of a start to an almost non-existing Intranet. It was simple enough to setup, but kind of failed because the Java views look like SHIT.
9) Rishi Sahi1677 (20 Feb 2009)
@ David , I too must say Notes java views are shittt.. In my 6 years of Notes carrier not a single client I have seen who wants to go for Java view. I don't understand what is the purpose of Java view , it just kills the performance.
10) Bruce Elgort8023 (20 Feb 2009)
Now, now with those naughty words people.
11) Rishi Sahi1677 (20 Feb 2009)
@ Bruce, from your profile got to know you are from Elguji , facing little problem with Ideajam. I am trying to update my profile , but getting this error ,

Rishi Sahi, you are not authorized to access . Please sign in with a name which has sufficient access rights:

I am in the site, but asking again n again when I am trying to update and save my profile.
12) Bruce Elgort8023 (20 Feb 2009)
Rishi - thanks for letting us know. We will have a look.
13) Rishi Sahi1677 (20 Feb 2009)
Thanks Bruce...
14) Bruce Elgort8023 (21 Feb 2009)
Rishi please try to update your profile. Matt fixed the problem for you.
15) Rishi Sahi1677 (23 Feb 2009)
@Bruce & Matt, Thanks I can do now.
16) Mark Demicoli11442 (27 Feb 2009)
@8 & 9: Don't you guys remember Java Applets being the 'cool new thing'? Then a few things happened:

1. Lotus started building the Java View without ever committing to full functionality or documenting the limitations. Probably because they realised it was actually a bigger undertaking than they thought. Same goes for the Java Rich Text editor.

2. Java Runtime started getting so fat that it took (and still does!) take 10 seconds to load on an average machine if it's not already in memory. Big java applet killer.

3. Developers quietly ignored this little experiment and views never reached their potential on the web without massive web programming skillz.
17) Rishi Sahi1677 (27 Feb 2009)
@16, I was just going through the SUN site and found even java professionals complained about Applet slow behavior . Still being a lotus professionals we can somehow ignore this.
Just remember the incident when I was in Sametime meeting with one of the Dutch user in The Netherlands. I have invited him in Sametime meeting so that I can look his issue through online screen sharing. When we both came online, After 7-8 mins or so my applet got loaded so I was in the room. But my poor user didn't had such luck he waited longer n longer .. At the end he ends up with blank white square box. He started giving blessings to Lotus Notes :-) , at last we had started conversation over phone .. So, thing is that we can support some bad stuffs about Lotus , but end user doesn't have such feelings...
18) Ralf Ludwig30 (11 Mar 2009)
OpenNTF.org should be fine
19) Patrick Kwinten22008 (11 Mar 2009)
@David: so OpenNTF is somehow in your words a platform where freelancers can upload their half-baked solutions in order to gain some consultancy fees?

IBM please add to OpenNTF a decent forum, a multimedia library, a solid website publishing tool, a simple facebook, faq, survey, news(letter) applications.
20) John Lindsay156 (11 Mar 2009)
OpenNTF is pretty good and I do like the stuff on it but there should be some better Apps out of the box. I particularly like the Website publishing suggestion. There was a book about it but that was back in the days of Domino 4.6.
21) Rishi Sahi1677 (12 Mar 2009)
I like { Link } , because lots of innovative idea you can borrow from there and people contribute as well , I assume because of reward :P. Still awareness and fair contribution needed for OpenNTF in Lotus community.
22) Mark Demicoli11442 (29 Mar 2009)
I think the cat needs to be let out of the bag. IBM needs to buy OpenNTF and provide financial and organisational support to 'good' projects. I mean, come on!
23) charles ross282 (17 Apr 2009)
First was the Nifty Fifty, Then the Sandbox, now we see OpenNTF. The idea with these is to get a framework to start from and modify to taste. To me OpenNTF is great but it tends to have a lot of consultant oriented offerings that are not so much "half baked" as they are too specific.

If you want off the shelf branded templates, that's very expensive - Microsoft does lavish loads of development work on stuff like that and Lotus does a certain amount of it also but not quite so much. A lot of this work may come from partners and the 2 orgs have different ways of treating their ISVs.
24) Mike Woolsey3998 (12 Feb 2011)
I really appreciate OpenNTF and think it's a great idea to use it.

I would really like some more formal assessments to go into OpenNTF to let people know what condition the project is in. I'm thinking the elemental levels Apple uses, or even the "alpha-beta-gamma-production" phases.

I think it's also important to list any / all needed third-party applications required for a template.

I think it's important.


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